gather for her

This is our Conversation:

CSJ Charlene SanJenko: Good morning, everyone. Thank you for being here bright and early on a Wednesday. Welcome to Gather for Her, a conversation to intentionally explore, share and dive into collective wisdom. 

I want to acknowledge the traditional lands on which I live of the Squamish First Nations and I ask that you reflect for a moment on the lands you call home. I’ve asked Nicolle Nattrass to join us this morning to chat about creativity, artistry and the intersection of where art meets leadership. 

At PowHERhouse we suggest that today's leaders need a braid of wisdom to uplevel their perspective, develop responsive skills and make seven generation decisions. Each week we gather to weave our wisdom together into the emerging story of us. Let’s kick it off with Nicolle. When I say artistry of impact, how does that land for you? What does that mean to you?

NN Nicolle Nattrass: Thank you. I'm excited to jump in. As you were reading my bio, I was thinking about Tina’s son baking cookies and it made me think if my bio was a big bowl of ingredients, what would the meal be at the end? It's been interesting to have so much of my varied career intersect this way. As soon as you said seven generations I thought: impact artists stand up and speak the truth. They use their voice, they are generative and they start from scratch, like a recipe. They spin it together and stand up by putting their voice out into the world. It requires courage and bravery, and change happens when we speak up. Impact starts when we risk standing up and speaking our truth. To me that is the artistry of impact.

CSJ: I fully agree. Tina, I wonder if you have a different view or if you'd like to add to that. What comes up for you around the artistry of impact?

Impact artists stand up and speak the truth - Nicolle Nattrass

TO Tina Overbury:  I could listen to Nicolle speak for hours. I love what you said about standing and speaking your truth. As someone who has devoted her life to story, diving into myths and the oral tradition, when I think of impact, I think of the stories we can still feel after we’ve heard them. Impact is how art changes us and we may not even be able to name it until after the ‘story’ is done with us. It impacts us because it speaks to us on a non-cognitive level. Stories call us out. They say: I see you. I hear you. Let's talk. As I dive into storytelling from an oral tradition, just like what happened at our recent FireCircle, you can't mistake how we can hear the stories we can't yet put into words but we hear just the same. And that's Artistry of Impact to me. It's like riding the waves of words you can only hear through art. 

CB Christina Benty: Good morning! When I think of artistry, I notice we often-times pigeonhole art and artistry don’t we? We don't necessarily realize our creativity has many forms. I hear from people all the time: I'm not creative. I'm like, yeah give me ten minutes and let me ask you a couple questions and let’s see. The artistry of how you are in the world is reflected in the work you do. Oftentimes I work with a lot of technical folks like engineers, and in a ten minute conversation, I can pull out their artistry and see how their creativity contributes yet they don't recognize it, but it contributes to the impact they are making in their industry.

CSJ: I love that. I want to second what Christina said. It's funny how we pigeonhole things, right? Remember growing up? In school you were either a jock or you were super smart. You were either a theater geek or you were a cheerleader. There were definite pockets, and Christina, one of the things I loved about you when we first met is that you were the mayor and a wicked jazz singer. For me, the artistry of impact just means encouraging each other to explore all the different sides of ourselves.

It's like riding the waves of words you can only hear through art. - TinaO

CB: When I remember that I like to sing and I love to write, and I love to be silly, and that I can do all of it and still show up and be professional it encourages me to bring my whole self to a situation. For so long we’ve thought we had to put it in compartments.

NN: Can I jump in on this? I think there's something about creativity and our need to pigeonhole it. It's so true. When I think of my bio, for so long people wanted to pigeonhole me to understand me. 

So you're an actor? 

Well, I'm a writer too. I write my own work. 

Oh, so you only write your own work? 

No, I just like to. 

We can do anything creatively. To the recipe analogy, one of my friends can come over to my house and when I think I have no food, she’ll open my cupboards, take out six different ingredients and make the most beautiful recipe ever. That's creative. Anything in creativity is about starting from perceived nothing. We add all these things together and whether we deliver our creativity on stage or in the marketplace, in a book, a gallery, or with a friend, artistry of impact is huge. Sometimes I think we don’t see it because of pigeonholes. 

What about getting back to being allowed to have a hobby. My mom likes to play the piano. She's not going to be a Carnegie pianist, but it gives her joy and it’s super creative. We need to get away from that idea we have to be the best or the most. 

CB: Can I jump in for a second because I love that Nicolle, it’s just so delicious. I often tell my clients that political life is an art and a science. It's two sides of the same coin. When you're crafting policy, artistry is involved and at the same time it has to be steeped in science. But it's the artistry that leads to the outcome. I remind people this process isn’t linear, it's lateral and it's messy. 

CSJ: Tina, I'm going to jump into the next piece of the conversation but I'm wondering if there is there anything that you heard here that you'd like to reflect back or dig into further,

TO: I just want to name the pain point of pigeonholing. We might want to call it the division or the two sides. I hear the desire to move dissolve in the ‘mist’ which is also right into the mess.

This process isn’t linear, it's lateral and it's messy. -Christina Benty

CSJ: I love that. Thank you. I'd like to segue a tiny bit and kick off this next section by talking about the process, specifically the artistry. My experience of this one woman show led me to make a pretty bold statement on social media. I said I believe every woman leader should seriously consider writing and performing a one woman show, and Nicolle, I'm curious from your point of view, why on earth do you think I would say that? As someone who's been involved with this form for a very long time, what do you hear there? 

NN: Well first of all, I loved it. It didn’t take me back at all because I think it goes back to something you said during your show: Feed The Fire which is: if you were not called, you wouldn't be compelled. And I think we're in a position as women leaders who are called therefore compelled, that we don't get to say: You know what, I'm just not gonna do that. We can’t step away because it’s time we step up, and in my experience, working on a solo show is  doing just that. We don't write shows about something we kind of enjoy. We write about the things we are super passionate about. We have to say the words because we are compelled to say them. No one writes a show about something they could just take or leave. When I wrote my first solo show it was because I looked around I couldn't see myself in other people’s words anymore. I couldn't hear my truth. I couldn't hear the stories I needed to hear. 

I believe every woman leader should seriously consider writing and performing a one woman show.- Charlene Sanjenko

I think there's something about that need when we talk about social impact. It’s how we make sure we are hearing all the stories and not just some. My desire to step out and write my first show was about me thinking: there has to be other people out here who have this story in their heart. I need to reflect it to them. I was standing on the edge of the cliff like the fool on the tarot card who looks at the rose and thinks well, I hope it goes okay, but not knowing. The level of risk is huge, and yet when we dare to step out and tell the story, it opens up this freedom for other people to get it and say that's my story too. There's an interconnectedness that happens. I think what happened with your show: Feed The Fire is you managed through your story, your voice and your artistry, to interconnect with us on a larger scale.This is so needed right now.

CSJ: I just wanted to pull one little piece of that out and say, I love what you said about interconnectivity. Art and artistry is a vehicle that basically helps us to explore connection. We talk a lot about it and we're trying to find ways to unite, but what's the vehicle? What's the how? Christina, what thoughts did you pull out?

 

I couldn't see myself in other people’s words - Nicolle Nattass

 

CB: I gravitated toward a couple of things. One of them is talking about delivering other people’s words when you can’t see yourself in it. I’ve had that experience before, when I was supposed to present someone else’s stuff and my soul just couldn’t feel it. Finding your way requires an intensive birthing process of creativity. Even if I’m talking about asset management, I’m in a creative birthing process. 

CSJ: I’d like to reflect on a few things about the process of writing my one woman show. It made me think about being twelve years old and I was that kid who was always performing. I had so much joy in doing that. Then I combined my love for performing with the question I love to ask women and friends which is: What do you stand for? What is this all about for you? 

I’m always interested in knowing someone’s truth, if they know it, and if they are brave enough to say it. The one woman show attracted me as a format because it gave me the opportunity to share my conviction with the world and in doing so, it pushed at my edges. There’s not a lot of places where we can practice taking a stand for what we believe in.

NN: If I can add to the process part of this conversation. One of the words that keeps showing up for me as of late is creative alchemy. It’s everywhere. It’s how things come together. Everything starts as an idea which is motivated by a conviction, and driven by a compelling desire to share as if you are being called.

Creative Alchemy

• An idea
• Motivated by conviction
• Driven by a compelling desire
• As if you are being called

There needs to be an idea, but you need to be open to letting the story show up and unfold into being what it wants to be. It’s a messy process. What was your process like Charlene? 

CSJ: I want to bring it back to the call. Regardless of the outcome, let’s encourage a process that supports knowing what your truth is and how to speak it, and start looking for vehicles to share it. Nicolle, your process of using recipe cards to capture ideas throughout my day was a  game changer for me because they took the overwhelm out. Every time I got an idea I would jot it down and depending on my mood, sometimes I’d use the cards, and other times I’d use a kid's big scrapbook and just write really big across the page, like a brain dump. It was my process of unlocking and answering the question of my call: 

• What is important to you? 
• What are you deeply convicted about?  
• How does that show up in the world? 
• What does that actually look and feel like in real time? 

NN: It’s a process of trust. Trusting your own way, and your own voice. Sometimes you are on the hairy edge of truth and you just need to hear someone say: I hear you. I’m going to help you. Let’s stay on track together. It’s a beautiful and unique process.  It’s as if tuning into the irreplaceability of each person’s unique message makes the story universal.